Amway Global.com - Official Site of Amway Global / Quixtar Inc.
Amway's Powerful Woman
Thursday, September 25, 2008

Recently Forbes published its list of the World's 100 Most Powerful Women (September 15, 2008 issue), and I was pleasantly surprised to see Eva Cheng listed as #88.  Eva is Amway's top executive for Amway Greater China and Southeast Asia which represents just under half of Amway's global revenues. I know that she is regarded with high respect and admiration within the company and within the markets she oversees. It was only surprising to me that she had emerged on the radar of a major U.S. business publication. I don't know a lot about Eva, so reading that she began her career with Amway Hong Kong as a secretary in 1977 made me appreciate her accomplishments all the more!

Eva Cheng

Eva Cheng, EVP--Greater China & Southeast Asia 

Many people here at Amway have super long tenures. Even though I've been here nearly 17 years, there are puh-lenty of people who have a ton more tenure with this company. It's a great testimonial to how much employees love working here and how well this company values and treats its employees. In my work with outside vendors, I'm often asked about what I do and how long I've been here yadda yadda.  When I tell them I've been here as long as I have, their jaws often drop open because, to them, it seems unfathomable that 1) there are still companies out there where the potential for lifetime employment exists and 2) that staying with a company for so long can be good for your career.

It is true that this company is remarkable in its employee retention. People in West Michigan aspire to work here and newer recruits from across the country have found the company and the area quite welcoming. While it's true that there may be opportunities to job hop and achieve upward career trajectory, as one agency person has shared, personally I love what I do here, and who I do it for, and who I do it with.

There certainly are challenges, but there also are wonderful accomplishments to celebrate. Accomplishments like being ranked the 88th most powerful woman in the world!  Imagine!  Some people simply aspire to be the 88th most powerful person in their town, or maybe their high school. To be listed ahead of Queen Rania and Christiane Amanpour?!  How cool is that?!  Queen Elizabeth did finish 30 spots higher than Eva, so she certainly has the opportunity to set even higher goals for herself!

The downside of having so many people here so long is that you can fall into a rut of "how we do things." It's been good to have outside influences shaking up that mentality and getting us to streamline processes and focus better and achieve more. The transformational changes we've been making for the past year and will continue to make in the years ahead make me excited to be here and to continue to serve the DeVos and Van Andel families, the leaders within this company, and the IBOs who are taking control of their own destinies through an Amway Global business. We all can strive to do and achieve more, since there's probably a lot of room between where each of us is at and #88 in the world. Unless your name's Eva, of course!

 



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Comments

quixtarisacult said:
Sunday, September 28, 2008 #

Seems that bragging up someone that is not even in the top 20, 40, 50, 60, or 70, and who is at the bottom of the 80s like she is the best thing since sliced bread is like trying to brag up a race horse that finished next to last. I am sure Eva Cheng is a competent employee, but not the mover and shaker necessary to rank higher on Forbes list. At least she made the list, that is about the extent of that. Top 10--start bragging.  

Isn't it ironic that you crow over this Forbes article, but remained quiet when Forbes described Amway as a Pyramid Scheme in their article about Orrin Woodward, former Amway Tool Kingpin, CLIMB TO THE TOP.  How did that go over at your organization?  Sounds like group think is routinely practiced in Ada.

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EDITOR'S NOTE:  Are you kidding me?  We have an employee who is in the top 100 of the world and you don't think that's a big deal?  I ask you to look at the list and notice the company she's keeping.  It's not a list of the top 100 women in business, or the top 100 companies. It is a major accomplishment for a woman who began her career with this company as a secretary! 
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As for how we're described in media reports, we are often referred to (inaccurately) as a pyramid by news media because it's their shorthand (lazy) way to desribe MLM companies. They don't usually even realize that pyramids are illegal and that using this term is irresponsible. We have sent countless letters and notes and phone calls to news media about this casual reference to our business, and they usually don't understand the significance. The people who take the time to actually understand our business understand that rewards are based on sales, no income is earned on recruiting, no quotas or "stockpiling" of products is required or allowed, and all purchases are covered by a money-back guarantee.    -- RL

visioneer said:
Monday, September 29, 2008 #

In reference to qiac's comment he consistently writes the same things over and over about Amway Global. He incorrectly uses the "pyramid" term and often mis-characterizes our business opportunity.

To be in the top 100 in the world is an awesome achievement and I would question the character of anyone who would denigrate that.

rocket said:
Monday, September 29, 2008 #

Sorry Luymes, the reason people don't know what you want them to know is because the Amway corporation has done a horrible job reeling in problem IBOs, and actually heralded them publicly.

Sorry man, when you blame people for not accepting the corporation's definitions and explanations, you have to understand that's because you empowered people who have abused that authority.

Those folks may have made Amway successful, but they are also why you at the corporation are changing.

Yet there are STILL no public rebukes for that destructive behavior.

Not acknowledging facts, or distorting facts,  is a form of lying to many people.

When IBO's who are later found to have been lying about a number of things have said stuff like, "this isn't a pyramid", "2-5 years to financial freedom", or my favorite, "buy products you buy anyways only for a 30% wholesale cost saving"

It's not difficult to see why the media and the population at large view your company the way they do.

I also don't believe you at the corporation aren't aware of that.

In this case, if you don't like the message, then shoot the messengers (figuratively).

It would be about time.

Woodward doesn't count, he says he quit.  Make a statement about what is and isn't acceptable, and make it public.

Then, and only then, will you regain the confidence of the public.

Don't point fingers about people saying the wrong things, they are saying what they were told by YOUR IBO's.

Bridgett said:
Tuesday, September 30, 2008 #

rocket,

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As usual, your comment makes no sense and is unrelated to Robin's post and even QIAC's comment.

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In other words, you are being an Internet troll.

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Do you want to be a CREDIBLE critic of this business?

Since

a)you are not an IBO and haven't been for 11 years, and

b)since  you choose not to be honest about who you are ("rocket" who IS rocket???), and

c)since you post irrelevant negative comments, (kind of like walking in to someone's home, puking on their carpet, and then leaving)

I don't know how you think you are credible.

Baffling. LOL.

Bridgett said:
Tuesday, September 30, 2008 #

According to Forbes, the way they determine the "power" of a woman is:

a composite of public profile--calculated using press mentions--and financial heft. The economic component of the ranking considers job title and past career accomplishments, as well as the amount of money the woman controls.

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Eva Cheng controls the purse strings of a VERY large purse. LOL.

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I am glad to see a woman in such a position because I think women are excellent marketers, and have a different way of going about it than men. Not better, just different. :)

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Ms Cheng is listed one of five leaders of all of Amway: http://www.amway.com/en/GlobalComm/leaders-evacheng.aspx

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And is listed as one of six members of the Executive Team of Alticor: http://www.alticor.com/resource-center/leadership/evacheng.aspx

ibofightback said:
Tuesday, September 30, 2008 #

One has to put QIAC's comments in context. This man of enormous achievement (not), also rubbished the 5 Olympic medals won by Team Nutrilite athletes as "failures". For some reason he seems muted about his own incredible sporting and business achievements.

Just modest I guess.

Dave Lenchanko said:
Tuesday, September 30, 2008 #

Bridgett, amway's biggest champion, IBOfightback hasn't been very active in the business since 1999 or so, yet you and your followers treat his word as the gospel truth.

IBOfightback himself always says his level isn't relevent if what he posts is the truth.  In this case, here are some facts.  Rebutt them if you can:

1.  The vast majority of people who register for this "awesome opportunity" make nothing or lose money.  (Legal pyramidal compensation plan)  The vast vast majority of IBOs dedicated to the system suffer losses month after month because of these system expenses.

2.  The retail sales is self declatory, rendering it useless.

3.  Eva Cheng could be #1 in the world and it still would not make more IBO's successful.

4.  The buy back rule must not be "all that".  Else why are products and useless tapes always being sold on Ebay for pennies on the dollar?

rocket said:
Tuesday, September 30, 2008 #

I commented because I felt quixtarisacult made a good point, about how the media portrays Amway, and was given the typical runaround damage control answer about how Amway is a victim wheen it comes to mainstream media.  If this thread was (according to Bridgett LOL) off toppic, the blog author himdelf put it off topic when speaking of how the media portrays inaccurate (cough cough) depictions of what Amway is.

Yet I notice (yet again) Bridgett refutes none of what I wrote.  Not surprising.

Eva Cheng is a powerful woman according to Forbes.  

How that translates into IBO success is anyone's guess I suppose....

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EDITOR'S NOTE:  I referenced use of "pyramid" as a term to describe our business.  It is based on a working knowledge of talking to the news media for the past 17 years on behalf of this company.  They typically don't realize that the term "pyramid" even has a negative connotation: it is a shorthand way for them to describe any business with a tiered compensation plan.  The media, when using this term, does not typically mean to infer that we are illegal (since pyramids are illegal). That was the point I was trying to make.  -- RL

 

tex said:
Tuesday, September 30, 2008 #

It's been good to have outside influences shaking up that mentality and getting us to streamline processes and focus better and achieve more. ---- You're welcome.

Pay little attention to QIAC and rocket, they are clueless.

Regarding the "pyramid" issue, most organizations are pyramidal in structure, it goes all the way back to Moses in the Bible. Although the "pyramid" word has a negative connotation, there are legal and illegal pyramids, Amway is a legal one, with a VERY unethical/immoral tool profit problem. Perhaps Eva could address the tool profit issue, the males in Ada seem to be incompetent/impotent in doing so, for over a quarter century.

Bridgett,

Do you want to be a CREDIBLE supporter of this business?

Since

a)you are a one-legged silver IBO who loves to brag about your 25% status, and

b)since  you chose not to be honest about who you are, until very recently, yet give others a hard time for keeping their identity confidential, and

c)since you post irrelevant positive comments and ignore the whole truth, (kind of like walking in to someone's home, puking on their carpet, and then leaving)

I don't know how you think you are credible.

Baffling. LOL.

visioneer said:
Tuesday, September 30, 2008 #

Bridgett,

Agreed. As I have said before about rocket and qiac, they are not interested in sensible discussions. They are only interested in posting negative/destructive comments and trying to come across as an "expert".

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EDITOR'S NOTE:  FYI -- I am ending this string since I was way to lenient in allowing personal attacks and don't want them to continue.  Sorry, this is something I allowed happen but don't have to allow to continue (here).  Thanks!  -- RL

Andrew C Sargeant said:
Sunday, October 05, 2008 #

Good Job Editor for terminating those attacks. This blog is for useful, inspiring, edifying information in relations to IBOs, The employees of Quixtar/Amway Global and to others relevant to its topics in promoting our business and its' interest with Integrity.

All the best.

PS. I think the Forbes information on Eva Cheng is credible to us and my honor goes to her for such commitment and loyalty.

Heavenly Father bless you

visioneer said:
Monday, October 06, 2008 #

Kia,

Not sure if you're going to allow this as it is still off topic but I'd like to comment on Dave Lenchanko's post. I am not attacking him, just trying to give a common sense response to his comment.

1. A good portion of IBO's who signup do so just to get the discount on the products. They never intend to turn a profit. I don't see how anyone could know what percentage of people are signing up just to do that. There fore, you're claim of a "vast majority" is highly suspect.

Of IBO's who have system expenses:

A. They get a benefit from those expenses of greater knowledge or belief or inspiration. In other words, I find a value in what I choose to use as tools for my business.

B. It's a simple matter of building your business through retailing and sponsoring that you can pay for expenses that YOU CHOOSE to use for your business.

2. The retail sales rule is self-reporting. Kind of like our tax system. It does depend on people being honest. I would like to believe that there are honest, hard working people out there that build the business properly.

Of those that are not, I believe the company has showed that they can and will kick out unscrupulous IBO's.

3. The point of the post was to simply edify Eva Cheng. How IBO's become more successful is to work at their business.

4. The buy back rule is there and it works as I have used it personally. If people choose not to use it themselves then that's their choice.

Is the business perfect? Of course not, its got people in it.

Is it still the best opportunity out there for the common man and woman?

I believe the answer is Yes!

Thanks if you allow this to post Kia. If not, I'll understand.

hurricane said:
Wednesday, October 08, 2008 #

Rockets comments show he has no clue on what he is talking about.  We have exclusive product lines that no one else has so whether the mark up on products are 30% ,10% or 50 or more like a lot of things, it is what it is and we do have on the average a 30% mark up on products!!What great value for these products and if a person does not like it they do not have to use it or buy it..

Georgia Boswell said:
Wednesday, October 08, 2008 #

Great comments, Visioneer. Congratulations to Eva Cheng

It is great to an Amway Global employee ranked in the top 100. China and SE Asia are huge responsibilities and very important markets for the company. I am proud to be part of a company that is dedicated to global free enterprise and especially one that brings hope and opportunity to billions in China and India.

rocket said:
Tuesday, October 14, 2008 #

"Rockets comments show he has no clue on what he is talking about. "

No personal attack there at all.

You run a pretty tight ship here Luymes.

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EDITOR'S NOTE:  You're right, rocket.  I apologize.  It gets hard to moderate comments when someone slips in the personal attacks in larger posts where they're trying to make a valid point.  I will try to be more diligent.   RL

quixtarisacult said:
Thursday, October 16, 2008 #

Luymes, I would like to point out that the personal attacks were being not made by anti-Amway commenters, but by the Ambots.  I criticised not a one of them, but I did criticize legitimately the Forbes describing Amway as a pyramid. Which you know it to be.  

I also find it very convenient that you rejected a very important comment of mine in the above string of comments. Consider this a follow up.  An on topic opinion about your Ava Cheng post.

Twenty thousand Amway apologists can not discount the bad truths about the Amway  scam business, tool scandal, and money extracting motivational activites.  

Forbes is the topic, Eva Cheng is the Amway current poster child for respectability--not.  You brag on midgets while you flock/fleece the minions.  

Even Tex, above managed to paint your wonderful Amway business as corrupt scandal that he knows it to be. Cheng is chit.  

I can understand you wanting to close down comments, but you have now opened them back up, as if only more pro Amway people will be coming by and get all teary seeing their beloved pyramid bismirched by Forbes?

Luymes, do yourself a favor, fire yourself.  

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EDITOR'S NOTE:  OK, I'll let you through with one, QIAC.  I have not not posted anything you've sent to me (as you reference above), so I don't know what you're talking about.  True, I wasn't careful enough (as I've already apologized to rocket) in closing down comments.  Our blog management tools don't actually allow me to simply "close" comments ... I just have to remember to not accept new comments on a particular string that I say I have "closed."  I usually don't check which string is being responded to ... anyway, I apologize I apologize I apologize. 

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I stand behind my earlier comments regarding Eva Cheng, pyramid misnomers and Forbes and the news media. After 17 years here, I think I also have a handle on what are very real problems within this business (and there are real problems) and how the company is now addressing them. The whole point of the Opportunity Zone is to discuss the issues surrounding our business, and we've not shied away from that discussion.  I am proud to be affiliated with this company, this business, and the hundreds of thousands of IBOs here in the U.S. and around the world. I am disheartened by those who incessantly beat a one-note drum and see only the black and white and not the shades of gray in-between.

I have no idea what you mean by chit. But please, don't feel compelled to tell me ... I don't care that much.  And please, in the future, do call me by my first name, Robin, or by the Kia handle, I don't care.  I just can't help but think when you and rocket use my surname that it's done with some sort of disdain. You know, like in Seinfeld, when he says "Newman" in that long, drawn-out way of his.    --- RL

visioneer said:
Thursday, October 16, 2008 #

Robin,

Thanks for the response to qiac and rocket. I applaud all that you, and Amway Global as a company is doing to improve this business. We all know that this business is not perfect, it does have its problems. But the transformation is happening, and I look forward to the solutions!

rocket said:
Thursday, October 16, 2008 #

It was the first sentence in Hurricane's post.

No disdain intended, I call guys on my sports team by their last names, and I am sorry you took it as insulting.  If you wish me to cease, I will.

I am glad you openly admit to problems in the business, it's a shame, but it is what it is.

Personally, I am (in Bridgett terms) baffled at why those very challenges aren't openly discussed.

IBOFB is proving to be a poor PR rep, self proclaimed or not.

Thanks for the apology, I do accept, and here's to a fantastic weekend!

quixtarisacult said:
Saturday, October 18, 2008 #

Maybe some progress is being made, at least pro-Amway people are admitting that problems exist.  Seems like calling money extracting schemes merely a problem is a radical under statement though!  

Seems like you have more public relation letters to write (to Japan this time) because there is more scandal involving Amway being described as a "pyramid" there.  You've got to be thinking: can't let Forbes get away with it; can't let Japan get away with it either even when they are elected members of the government: Click here to read.  

Robin, you must keep them honest; after all it is your job.

Strange that political contributions are coming back to haunt politicians and Amway in Japan.  Are there any potential scandals on the horizon here in the States of a similar nature? Heaven knows enough Amway money finds its way into the hands of politicians.

Personally, I have nothing against, Cheng. Seems like stories like this only serve to provide a cover, a respectability cloak over what really is a very questionable industry at its very best. Indeed, if it didn't have such a bad history of leaving people in the red, maybe it wouldn't even be an issue.

I guess you had better go to the copier and make some more of your complaint letters about the use of "pyramid".  It will help return some of your Amway money back to the Japanese Photo-copier industry.

Visioneer... Let me ask you one question: What has all of Amway's transformation done to stop the Tool Scam from continuing?  Aren't the Tool Kingpins still operating their businesses?

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EDITOR'S NOTE: Thanks QIAC for your opinions.  I'm not aware of our issues in Japan since I oversee Advertising, PR and Sponsorships for the U.S.  There's another PR person I'm sure who has a letter ready to go for erroneous references in Japan.  Regarding Eva, you may refer to the honor she received as a "cloak of respectability"; others will view this as a testament to the respectable business we are at the core, despite the issues we deal with (not unlike most businesses). We are dealing with those issues, but transformation doesn't happen overnight. From compensation plan to product offering to the training we provide from the company, change is happening and having a positive impact on the business. 

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A point of clarification: our transformation doesn't necessarily mean the end of business support materials (BSMs) and meetings.  It just means more review of them to ensure they provide value and accreditation of the BSM businesses to ensure they employ best practices and fair policies.  It is an added level of consumer protection we're providing to IBOs and their customers across the U.S. and Canada.

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I hope you are well QIAC and thanks for commenting.

ibofightback said:
Wednesday, October 22, 2008 #

The Japan issue seems to be little more than a political beat up, ¥160,000 over 6 years? That's less than US$200/yr! That doesn't exactly buy a lot of favours :)

quixtarisacult said:
Wednesday, October 22, 2008 #

Robin,

Thank you for giving my comment fair treatment. [Edit]

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EDITOR'S NOTE:  You're welcome QIAC.  I edited the additional comment you made that uses terminology that we've asked not be used in the Opportunity Zone.  Thanks!  -- RL 

visioneer said:
Wednesday, October 22, 2008 #

Robin,

Sorry to continue the off topic posts, but this is in reference to qiac's question.

In my opinion, I get an exceptional value from my LOA's tools. The pricing on CD's, books, and functions are far below the market value. There are many good training companys out there, such as Nightingale-Conant. However, their pricing on CD's is much higher than what I am paying. I've also checked out seminars from Dale Carnegie, Robert Kiyosaki, and Franklin Covey, all good reputable companies, once again, the pricing is much higher than what I'm paying.

I've also checked out other unified messaging systems. Our system is VERY competitive with all of the features that we have.

We have table tents for merchandising products, they are very professional looking. The price is $19 for 19 of them. I could not go to Kinko's and just make a copy of them for $19. If I had to design my own, it would cost me in the hundreds of dollars and dozens of man hours to make it.

We also have forms that we use to show the plan. They cost .50, if I went to Kinko's to make a color copy of them, it would cost me $3. That's not even figuring in the cost of the dozens of man hours it took to design them. On top of that, it had to go through Q-legal to be approved. That's more time and money that I didn't have to invest in.

Should I go on?

In other words, I get an awesome benefit for being a part of a "system" that has tools that I CHOOSE to use. Nobody forces me to use the tools. If some people make a profit off of that, then great! I'm glad I live in a Free Enterprise society that rewards people for producing high quality products with exceptional pricing.

His frequent mis-characterization of this business just shows his true nature.

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EDITOR'S NOTE:  Thanks V.  The key points you make that the tools you buy are 1) of value and 2) completely optional are great.  Those are elements of accreditation, by the way.  We also try to ensure that any materials sold in this manner are accurate and truthful.  If "Joe IBO" (as opposed to Joe the Plumber) chooses to not use these materials and finds success, great!  If they choose to use these tools and finds success, great!  And if they use them and are not successful, it's not necessarily the tools' fault.  There are many times I have used the tools I have incorrectly and not achieved my desired results.  Again, if they're of value, buy them, if not, don't.  Let market rules dictate whether or not the BSMs succeed.  But that means there cannot be undue pressure to buy them.  But even when there is pressure to buy, Joe IBO needs to be accountable for the business expenditures they make.  From RDV down, the mantra has been to buy only those tools that you find helpful, and to not go into debt doing so!  To me, that just sounds like common sense.  -- RL

Tex said:
Friday, October 24, 2008 #

Visioneer/RL,

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Your tool "value" discussion sounds good in theory, but has little in common with the practical reality.

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Reality check:

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#1. You can't show a marketing plan describing how to make money with Amway, have a material omission that most of the money is actually made from the tools, and if you follow the recommended system you and your IBO's won't make a net profit until they reach the Platinum level. This is not value, it is lying.

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#2. Completely optional is a fallacy. When I went off of standing order tools over 3 years ago, I went from being a "best buddy", to someone the upline ignored. No invitations to training sessions, special open opportunity meetings, calls for tickets to seminars/major functions, phone calls to see how I was doing, Christmas party invitations, e-mails, etc., etc., etc. In other words, the required training and motivation went to zero, and Amway did NOTHING to enforce the rules. That is "optional" in name only.  

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#3. "Truthful and accurate" MUST include the truth about how much money is being made via the tools.

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#4. Most IBO's have never owned their own business, get involved with a sponsor who is a friend/relative, and are told over and over again to trust their upline. It is quite logical to follow the advice of those you trust, are constantly telling you they have your best interest in mind, and most IBO's are looking for advice in something they have never done.

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#5. The "market" cannot dictate whether or not BSM's "succeed", because covering up the tool profit means the tools almost ALWAYS succeed in making profit for the upline that sell them and RARELY result in helping an IBO with a sustainable business. A free market does not exist when your "teammates" and "business partners" are omitting material facts.

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#6. You can't tell Joe IBO that "RDV said" a single time, then allow Joe IBO to be hammered with a constant message of "ignore the corporation, they don't know how to build the business, we have your best interest, etc., etc., etc., and expect Joe IBO to make a good and informed decision. To me, that just sounds like common sense.

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EDITOR'S NOTE:  Thanks Tex. "Most money" from tools is your assertion, not necessarily fact.  I do not doubt that leaders who built large businesses are now able to capitalize on that because others want to emulate that success.  For most people, the business opportunity we support can and will generate income that will help them achieve their goals. That is what we can disclose, and in our materials we are very realistic about what can be achieved with an Amway Global business.  We even disclose that some IBOs are earning significant income from business support materials and that these are optional.

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Tex, they ARE optional.  If you don't think they provide value, don't buy them. If they help you build your business, then it is an investment you might want to make. We disclose this in our materials and we also provide our own training that can help people get started without necessarily investing a lot in the BSMs. I do think it's in the best interest of IBOs to adequately prepare their downline to sell products and to prospect others; I also know that most newer IBOs aren't equipped to do this and require someone higher in their leadership structure to help them ... those people can't be everywhere and therefore are compensated to speak at larger meetings or to be featured on a CD or DVD. This training  

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Truthful and accurate is exactly what we provide in our materials. Disclosure about what we know to be true vis a vis earning in your Amway Global business are made. Speculating on how much certain individuals make from the sale of BSMs would be just that -- speculation. Through accreditation and the BSM review process we are  trying to bring greater consistency and value to the experience IBOs have with these materials.

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As I've said before, please have patience. We are going through a transformation and that might involve several moltings before we emerge in the form we desire. There is no magic wand that you can wave over the problems we've experienced to make them just disappear.  The business had evolved over the decades, and we appreciate all of you who are working with us over these few years to create a model for the industry and a powerful opportunity for IBOs for many decades to come!   -- RL

quixtarisacult said:
Friday, October 31, 2008 #

I am resubmitting this comment with changes made in terminology describing the high level Amway business (owners):

Kia...

Don't you see a conflict of interest in "high level Amway business owners" pushing their profitable tool businesses, regardless of all of the apologist views expressed by other commenter's? Just the fact that the "high level Amway business owners" derive most of their profit from the tools and not Amway commissions from downline volume presents a questionable circumstance--one commonly referred to as the tool scam.  

Proponents downplay the promotion of these tools as if they truly were optional items (which they are made out to be whenever questions arise involving them).  What happened to the "Tools are optional, but so is success?" which happens to be the way the tool business really rolls?  

Could it be that tools do not create the kind of major drain on new IBOs like some critics (like Tex) suggest?  

I'll ask you Robin precisely: What has Amway done--beside play lip service--to reign in the tool selling money making pursuits of the "high level Amway business owners?" There seems to be a major conflict of interest with saying the tools are optional while making them the key to success at the very same time?  It can't really be both ways?  You therefore transfer responsibility onto individuals instead of actually overseeing the "high level Amway business owners" operation which proceeds as usual.  

I will offer a compliment.  It at least seems that Amway is attempting to do  something in a very touchy situation short of sending more tool selling "high level Amway business owners" packing.

Seems like there are two things promoted in Amway: Products and tools.  I believe Rich Devos attempted to restrain the tool selling monopoly some years back, but yet it survives basically unchanged to this very day.  

Shouldn't IBOs know how much a tool selling "high level Amway business owner" like XXXXXXXXXXX derives from his tool selling empire? Might Amway institute a ceiling on tool profits much the way MonaVie does now?  Couldn't Amway do more than they have done?  A person has to retail an awful lot of product to offset the cost of tool and function expense. Shouldn't this be an issue for folk wanting to show black figures on their business accounts instead of the red most tax people see on MLM income tax reports year after year? I know there are exceptions, so please show some restraint.  

If Amway is indeed trying to promote retail selling? Might they do something to make Amway products more competitively priced?  If the independent businesses were truly successful, might we critics have much less to be critical about?  

You mention market rules as controlling tools, but in Amway, the "high level Amway business owners" basically operate a monopoly business.  The tools they sell for maybe $7 per tape might only bring cents on the dollar in a real world competitive market.  I am only responding to your use of market forces analogy.  Sorry that comments have gone so far off topic, but like on my blog, that seems to be more common than not. To use your way of thinking, IBOs should go and buy the common self help materials that the kingpins offer on eBay. Seems like that should make sense to you.  I'm sure you can find "How to Win Friends and influence People" along with other titles much cheaper there or elsewhere. Why buy from the monopolists?

visioneer said:
Friday, October 31, 2008 #

Tex,

My tools discussion is based on the fact that I have a profitable Amway Global business and I am not yet a Platinum. I believe in the tools because they help me and my downline to build this business. Not only that, but they are critical in helping my downline to stay in.

In my opinion, as someone who is actively building this biz, is that the tools save me time and money.

If my downline gets off of standing order (or any other tool), then they are still my partner in this business and I help them as much as they are willing to be helped.

Your case of your upline cutting you off is a sad one, but I wonder if your "attitude" might have had something to do with that? If you didn't that's fine, but in reading your posts, I wouldn't negate the fact that there are always two sides to the story.

qiac, you said "If the independent businesses were truly successful, might we critics have much less to be critical about?"

Uh, no, you would just find something else to be critical about.  

thechaser said:
Saturday, November 01, 2008 #

why isn't anyone attacking the Tool Scam in Mona Vie??? I am pretty sure that would be big chunk of income for Orrin and others who jumped to Mona Vie.

I know for a fact there is someone in Aust starting one up.

People bag the tool business yet forgetting that it is still optional and there are people out there that buy tools voluntarily and gain benefits out of it.

I know its completely off topic but hey... what the heck.

Congrats to Eva!!

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